Till I decide to retire, there’s no hope for the others
anuradha choudhary
Shah Rukh Khan takes his fame on two levels, one he revels in it and the other he winks at it. He loves making films but scoffs at the excesses of fame. He takes his work seriously but never himself. When he jokes about someone else, there is always a healthy dose of self-deprecation. Today he has dialled down his energies. The terrible pain in his back is taking its toll. But talk to him for a while and his usual wit and frivolity prevails. And you find yourself laughing a lot with him.
As he massages his back, I ask:
Did you think Devdas would go to the Oscars?
(Laughs) To be honest, I thought even Asoka should have been there. I am happy for Sanjay Leela Bhansali; he put a lot of hard work into the film. Also, Devdas is a great choice to represent popular cinema in India. It is an Indian Moulin Rouge. If Moulin Rouge can go, Devdas can too.
Vyjayanthimala says that you played yourself in Devdas.
I read that too. What can I say? To be honest, it hit me, I felt bad. And then she also says that she hasn't seen the film.
I don't know this lady. She is a great actress, a great dancer. Her words show that she is still in love with the Devdas she did. I respect her for that. And I don't mean it diplomatically. It's just that for me, my film is the best, hers is the best for her. It's just that I think it would have made a little more sense if she had seen the film and then commented on it.
(Grins) Maybe in 20 years I will be able to say that my Devdas is better. I can't say that now, not just out of humility but also out of respect.
Was it easier for you to say yes to Ashutosh Gowariker for Swades than for Lagaan?
(Laughs) Till yesterday, Ashu was asking me, 'Shah, tu kar raha hai, na? Main haan samjhun?' As if it was a shaadi ka proposal. We went through the whole hoopla this time too.
I would have definitely done Lagaan. I'll take whatever I'm interested in. But some things don't happen. Lagaan showed that you can make a different kind of film and get away with it. I like the fact that Ashu is making a film like Swades after Lagaan. He is making the film he wanted to make. Other film heroes rejected his film, asked for changes. He was more willing to take a newbie than compromise on his script. I like that attitude. It's that incorruptibility in him that wins half the battle.
One actress you seem to spend a lot of time with is Preity Zinta.
No, I don't know Preity too well. Actually, I knew her before she got into films. She was Gauri's friend and she came to our house. She wanted to be an actress and I was asked to help her. But I said I don't suggest or reject any names.
Shekhar Kapur suggested her name to Mani Ratnam for Dil Se. After that, I didn't work with Preity for a long time. Then we did the Santro ad together. The Santro people cast her. I produced that ad. So it wasn't like we treated her any special way.
Our paths don't cross too often, there was a time when I didn't speak to her. Now that I'm working with her again, I'll be one hundred percent connected to her character.
I've never had such a bond with her as I do now. When I meet her, I say hello to her. It's just like I do with other people. Of course, my bond is deeper with actresses like Juhi, Madhuri and Kajol, with whom I have worked over so many years.
Reports are saying that Juhi Chawla and you are at loggerheads.
This is all rubbish. I read about it and it is very irritating. Because our company Dreamz Unlimited was not built just for business. It was built by very, very close friends. Even now when Aziz's wife is ill, we are all there together. If Aziz or I cannot go, Juhi is with her. That is how close we are. Our children play together, if her child cannot come, then I drive down to her house with my children.
Please, there is no fighting. I find it strange that I am being asked to explain something like this. But yes, we have slowed down. Because of my health. I tend to get too involved. Right or wrong, Juhi complained that she cannot devote too much time to the job and everything ends up falling on me.
What made you then start another production company, Red Hot Chilly Pepper, with Ratan Jain, where you already have Dreamz Unlimited and Arclightz?
We were doing Chalte Chalte under the Dreamz banner. Also, I had signed three big advertising campaigns - Videocon, Santro and Pepsi - to clear the debts of our previous projects. Too much was happening.
Farah wanted Dreamz to produce her film. But then Aziz Mirza was busy with Chalte Chalte. Juhi said she couldn't handle so much. So Juhi and Aziz felt that we should wait till December 2003 to do Farah Khan's Main Hoon Naa. Farah was obsessed with shooting in a special school in Darjeeling which has December holidays. She couldn't wait a year as she had already planned her shoot.
We had done two films (Phir Bhi Dil Hai Hindustani and Asoka) which barely made any money. We didn't want to make any mistakes with the finances of Chalte Chalte. And we weren't sure if we could handle two projects.
Since Farah was going to shoot in December 2002, we brought in Venus to co-produce the film. They are friends and have wanted to do a film with me for a long time.
I kept the production with me in the hope that one day I will be able to combine it with Dreamz.
Why did you take Aishwarya Rai out of your film?
Look, I am producing the film. As it stands, I have a lot of problems with it. I can understand an actor telling me he wants to go home because he has a personal problem. But then again, personal also means that it should remain personal.
I am not cold-hearted or mean. I am not even looking for sympathy. But I have to make this film for many more reasons than my other two films. One way to overcome my financial difficulties is to make it within a certain time period.
I am not saying this because of Aishwarya Rai or Salman Khan or what they shared or did not share together. It is their personal thing. I know them very well and I like them very much. But if it hurts my work, then it hurts me. Believe me, I have never hurt anyone professionally in my entire career. The incident was humiliating, very degrading. I felt very bad and I told them so.
Apparently, you didn't even inform her that she was being dropped.
I told her that we are not making this film. I thought this was the better way to end it. See, my director was humiliated, my production crew was humiliated. My personal humiliation? Maybe I could have swallowed that. After all, Salman is a friend. Maybe you shouldn't feel so insulted with a friend.
As a friend, I felt bad about my decision. But I had to take a stand as a producer. It was not a good start for the first day of the film. And I was not sure if continuing with her would not have led to a similar situation again.
Replacing someone is a big decision. Aishwarya Rai is a big star. We were a good combination after Devdas. We needed her more than anything else in the film. Maybe even more than Shah Rukh Khan. But I couldn't screw up a film, especially not this film. Well, maybe we will be OK, maybe not. But I had to do the right thing as a producer.
Is she very upset with you?
She is nice to me when we meet. We were just doing a show together in Delhi. I know there were rumours that I would never work with her again. That is not my style. As I said, I have never suggested or rejected anyone's name. I am not one to do that. There
were also rumours that Sohail Khan was 'dropped' from the film. But it was never that. We were looking for a new boy and Sohail was a new boy when we spoke to him four years ago. There was never any commitment to him.
How is your back now that shooting has started?
I am getting acupressure, acupuncture. My disc has slightly shifted into its original position. So technically it is a little better. But my doctors say that if I want to dance and do action scenes, I should better undergo surgery. They say that if I get it done, I will be 110 percent fine. Any other bone may break but not this one. So I think I will get surgery.
I don't like being unable to work. I had just got used to my knee injury. But this is mentally disturbing. I am very disturbed because I cannot play with my children. My son saw Koyla the other day and he doesn't believe that I did those stunts. I have to show him how I did them.
How does it feel when so many newbies are portrayed as the next best thing?
To put it modestly, there is room for everyone. (Grins) To put it immodestly, I don't think it's true. There is no alternative to me. In my life and in the work I do. If that sounds bad, too bad. Me, myself and I - that's what I wake up with in the morning. You can't go on for eleven years, waking up any other way.
Maybe I have blinders on. Maybe one day I'll regret that I never saw the competition. But there is no competition. I run my own race. And I won it. And I'll keep winning it, there's no other way.
Anyway, it's not flattering even to the other person when people say he's the next best thing. There's no such thing as the next best thing. There's either the best or it's no good. The next best thing is a compromise.
Really?
Yes. It's silly when people talk about me displacing Amitabh Bachchan. Amitabh Bachchan is Amitabh Bachchan. He is God. There is no substitute for him. But at the same time, another best can exist there. So is Aamir the best? Yes. Is Salman the best? Yes. Is Hrithik the best? Yes. Is Vivek Oberoi the best? Yes, he is.
Likewise, I am the best. I do what I do best. One thing you cannot take away from me is the integrity and humility with which I do my job. However, that is a deadly combination. Being humble in my work and arrogant about what I am.
Anyway, none of the contenders have caught up with you... till now.
(Chuckles) Till I decide to stay on the track, they will just have to fight with me. Till I decide to retire, there is no hope for anyone else. I believe that and I work with that belief. And that is not arrogance. It is a childish belief. Like my son believes that I am Batman.
Honestly, you will have to pull me away from that, retire me completely. There is no other way I will give up all that, I will die in the process. I love being a star. I love it so much that I will not give it up for anything in the world. When I see Amitabh Bachchan in action, I know the feeling. In fact, there is no alternative to acting.
Is it fame that fuels your ego?
No, honestly I don't know how famous I am. I'm really, really humble about it. I don't know how important it is to invite me to an event. I don't know how important it is to release a calendar for someone. So sometimes I say no and people get hurt.
I know there are people who encourage me. But I can't hear one person say, 'Go, Shah Rukh, go.' I'm just focused on my work.
They like me, when I'm acting or even talking about acting, forgetting that I have a back problem. I'm charged up. I'll jump off this damn building even now to get it right. I did it for Farah too. And I want someone who's never worked with me to know that I can still do it just as well as I did ten years ago.
I feel the thrill of going on stage and making people laugh. Though I have never gone on stage in my life and said 'I love you'. It's not that I don't want to tell my fans that I love them. I love you through the work that I do. I hope you like Kaun kambakht bardashta karne ke liye peeta hai. I hope you like Ishq kamina, I hope you like this one shot in Saathiya. I hope I have fulfilled all your expectations of me. That's what keeps me going. On the other hand, shooting every day can be very, very tiring.
Sometimes people tell me that it will burn me out. They say, 'Shah, you can't keep trying to make everyone happy.' But I haven't burnt out in 11 years. I think I can possibly be attractive for another 10, five or three years. But as long as I have the will to make people happy in return for them making me, I will do it.
Does getting older worry you?
I have that fear at times, but it hasn't taken hold yet. I only get it when I colour my hair. I wonder, am I the uncle at the party who gets cocky and starts dancing while everyone else laughs at him, 'Oh God! Uncle Anand is dancing again.' Am I that uncle or do these guys really respect me as much as they say they do?
When I meet youngsters, they say good things about my performances. And I wonder if they are making fun of me - 'Uncle Anand, dance.' Or are they really impressed - 'I didn't know Uncle Anand could dance so well.'
Till now, I feel young, look young and behave young. And that's because of my children. Mainly because of my son. He has rejuvenated me in the last four or five years. There have been times when I have told Gauri that I want to take it easy. But when I look at my son, I say, no, there is no time to take it easy. Otherwise he will be bored with me. There should be no generation gap between my son and me.
Over the years that I have known you, you have become more accommodating to people...
Yes, I am. I used to be patient; now I am more patient. There was a time when I was very irritable when things went wrong. Now I feel that nothing can go wrong long enough to worry me. I find that I don't need to react because time will fix everything. I have stopped getting angry. There have been a few situations recently when I could have gotten very angry indeed. But I kept my cool.
What situations?
Like that incident on the sets of Chalte Chalte. I could have really thrown a fit when I read Shobha De's article where she called me unmanly. I told her that I was disappointed in her. And I never do this for articles. I could have gotten angry. But I told myself that this too shall pass.
Maybe I got the impression that I am way above these things. I don't know whether I am a star or not, but in my heart I genuinely feel that I am a very big star. I feel that I just cannot do certain things.
Mind you, nothing is too worthless or small for me. I never say, 'Shah Rukh yeh nahin kar sakta.' I don't think there is such a thing as enough fame not to do something that you would normally do.
It's just that as an individual I have started to think that it is OK. I am not saying I will forgive them. But I will leave them alone. For one thing, they don't know the facts. Second, I have been given too much to take this as an affront. There is a saying - let the dogs bark, the elephants will move on.
I have never seen you so disturbed.
Yes. Because if you don't know the facts, keep your mouth shut. Because the facts can scare the hell out of you. And I told Shobha De that too. She doesn't know what she's talking about. It takes away a lot of your self-respect to be in that witness box and to be asked the kind of questions that I was asked.
You know that you have been, if not 100 percent, at least 51 percent honest. You have never screwed anyone. And you stand there in the witness box, feeling all the time that you are a victim. And I tell myself the only way I can keep calm and not lose my patience is to laugh it off and make jokes about it.
Then I read articles and letters in the newspapers saying how unmanly most of us have been. That's OK. I am brave enough to say I don't have the courage. But I challenge anyone who writes this or says that to come and have a conversation with me. Otherwise, tell me to my face. Writing five or six lines and getting away with it doesn't make you a man.
I know what makes a man. It takes a man to turn down an underworld film. Have you forgotten the people who made the film? The producer, the financiers, the film hero and the film heroines?
It takes a lot of courage to say no when you have been on top for so many years. I made excuses, said I hurt my leg. But I did nothing for them. And I am proud of it. To be honest, I thought I was a victim of all this. The whole thing felt very bizarre. Such things make you sad. And you wonder if you are being bullied just because you are a star. Then you tell yourself that this too shall pass.